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Tyre Dealers - Do you trust their advice?

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  • Tyre Dealers - Do you trust their advice?

    Called a few local tyre dealers today for advice and pricing on a new set of tyres... each one made a different recommendation, and bagged out the other.. What concerns me is the total lack of any measurement of the key metrics for a tyre, like wet/dry grip, braking performance, wear, puncture resistance etc - so how do we make an informed decision when it is based on the opinion of the person at the front counter who may or may not be influenced by margins/incentives and not what the actual tyre is capable of..?

    Planning to change my tyres soon and after some internet searching narrowed my list to Cooper ATT, Pirelli ATR, Bridgstone 697, and finally Toyo AT2. Some said Coopers were the go, where as the same franchise in another suburb said they were rubbish but the Toyo AT2 were the go. Others said the Yokohama GO15's were the best on the market at $450 per tyre of course. The Bridgestone dealer obviously said the 697's were perfect for my needs at $380. Nobody said the Pirellis were on their list....

    Lets put it another way... many tests have shown the difference in braking distances between tyres in the wet can be as much as 8 meters. That is the difference between soiled underwear and a few weeks in hospital. Then you are asked to fork out about $1200-1500 for these rubber donuts that are the only contact between the earth and 2T of flying metal keeping you and your family alive, and it is all based on opinion.

    So now I am back to the internet ( again opinion based..) and the manufacturers websites ( Biased and based on Marketing speak)... At some stage I am going to have to take a punt - the Cooper ATT and Toyo AT2's are neck and neck down the back straight.

  • #2
    Unfortunately I dont trust much advise from someone behind the counter of a store. Battery dealers are a prime example, from my personal experience. I always go online to see what the manufacturers specs are and then try and find some honest reviews...obviously not paid sponsors, like many of the 4wd episodes. I,ve said it heaps of times...just research and ask owners (even stop them for a quick chat at a shopping centre car park)...if they like the product they are normally more than willing to chime its positives. Personally I like the 697,s for bitumen driving only! Toyo AT2,S should be a great tyre. Two neighbours have them and are very happy. Both on twin cab utes.
    Dicko. FNQ

    2014 NW with all the usual stuff plus more.
    Some days your the dog...other days your the tree!!

    Telegraph X camper

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    • #3
      I went at2 not the new one out, after reading reviews as we must, the newer one seemed to have less positives in the wet.
      I use to run dueller 692 on my patrol and loved them, but decided on at2 and although still very mew am happy 👍
      Rob

      Comment


      • #4
        I am on my second set of Bridgestone Dueler D697s on my car, and quite happy with the grip, even in the wet. I haven't tried the other renown brands listed above, so cant make an effective comparison.
        Mitsubishi Pajero NT Platinum 2010

        Comment


        • #5
          As a general rule, I treat tyre shop employees with great scepticism - or probably cynicism is more accurate. Having said that, I have encountered a few that I considered to be trustworthy, and gave service and advice that I considered to be excellent. I currently don't have anybody in that category.

          I have had bad service and heard of terrible advice from tyre shop employees - like the twit who advised my father that reducing tyre pressures wasn't necessary, and he had recently driven Goog's Track, both directions, in one day at highway pressures.

          Anyway...

          A little about me to begin: I've tried a few different brands of off-road tyres, including at least 5 sets of Coopers - the original S/T, 2nd Gen STT, now on my third (or fourth?) set of ST Maxx. I consider myself a Coopers fan - but I've heard too many negative reports of Coopers AT tyres on wet bitumen to suggest anybody give them a go.

          As posted elsewhere on this forum, by myself and others, Bridgestone 697s don't seem to like the 4wding I do, so they're another tyre I would never recommend - but, to be fair, I think I give my tyres a harder time than you might.

          Toyo OPATs and Pirelli ATs are both tyres for which I don't recall hearing / reading bad reports.

          One last observation: every time I do the sums (in my head), I conclude that I spend more (per km) on tyres than I do on fuel. But given their importance to the entire driving experience (on and off road) I can't bring myself to buy tyres purely on price - I want tyres that will do what I expect of them, reliably. I'm very happy to pay more for my tyres at home if it means I spend less time dealing with tyre problems in the bush.
          NT Platinum. DiD Auto with 265/70R17 ST Maxx, Lift, Lockers, Lockup Mate, Low range reduction, LRA Aux tank, bull bar, winch, lots of touring stuff. Flappy paddles. MMCS is gone!

          Project: NJ SWB. 285/75R16 ST Maxx, 2" OME suspension, 2" body lift, ARB 110, 120l tank, bullbar, scratches, no major dents. Fully engineered in SA. NW DiD & auto in place - a long way to go....

          Scorpro Explorer Box

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          • #6
            Do not trust tyre resellers.

            You need the tyre that suits your use the best, so have a careful think about what you need in a tyre vs what you want in a tyre.
            If you choose a nice quite comfortable tyre HT passenger construction tyre that uses less fuel and has great wet weather grip then do not expect it to perform off the bitumen and or with heavy loads and towing.
            If you choose a heavy duty AT/MT or MT Light Truck 10 ply construction tyre you will have greatly increased off road traction, increased load carrying and toughness compared to a HT passenger tyre, but the trade off will be less comfort, more noise, higher fuel consumption and a deterioration of wet weather bitumen handling.
            AT tyres are a compromise between the HT's and MT's, it is just a matter of making your mind up where about you need and want to be between the 2 extremes.
            Once we know this then we can offer suggestion and people can chime in with first hand experience.

            In reputable brands there are no bad tyres just bad tyre choices by vehicle owners.

            OJ.
            2011 PB Base White Auto, Smartbar, Cooper STMaxx LT235/85R-16,TPMS, HR TB, 3 x Bushskinz, front +40mm Dobinson , rear +50mm EHDVR Lovells, Dobinson MT struts and shockers, Peddars 5899 cone springs, Windcheater rack, GME UHF, Custom alloy drawer system inc. 30lt Engel & 2 x 30 AH LiFePo batteries + elec controls, Tailgate hi-lift/long struts, Phillips +100 LB & HB, Lightforce 20" single row driving beam LED lightbar, Scanguage II.
            MM4x4 Auto Mate, Serial No 1 .

            Comment


            • #7
              Flip a coin mate. You have a less than 50% chance of making the right decision.

              I think that almost everyone who works in a retail tyre store is going to be somewhat biased towards the brands that they sell, so waste of time asking them for an honest recommendation.

              You could ask on an appropriate forum, but all you'll get there is post purchase rationalisation or opinions based on no experience at all. Or buyer's remorse so strong that a poster would do almost anything to prevent someone else buying a product, regardless of whether it suited the other person's needs. If asking for a recommendation for one of two choices, most responses will be for a third option, usually completely unrelated.

              Of course, one could go along to a 4WD Club outing and actually observe how different tyres perform in given conditions..........Nah, far too sensible.

              Given that no-one wants to make a mistake with something as intrinsically safety related as tyres, nor something as potentially expensive, the research path can be a long and arduous one. Sometimes little comments like "the newer one seemed to have less positives in the wet" can have serious implications, especially when the comparison is being made against a tyre that used to have a terrible wet weather performance, but not any more. Why?

              I went through a similar process, seeing the writing on the wall for the need to replace tyres that were simply not doing the job. Simple it is not. First you have to identify why the tyres you have aren't doing what you want and then try to find another that will. Are you really comparing apples with apples? The Toyo is a 12.7mm tread depth and 120R load/speed rating while the Cooper is 9.2mm and 116H. Not 100% clear on the Cooper website but I suspect not even LT construction. A better comparison with the Toyo would probably be the Mickey Thompson Deegan 38 AT.
              Chris

              Comment


              • #8
                Toyo OPATS have had a fair bit of recent criticism for premature cracking of and between tread blocks well before tread has worn out.
                Last edited by redbruce; 1 week ago.
                MY15 NX Exceed, Auto Mate PRO, Paddle shift kit, dual batteries, Redarc BCDC, MM tow hitch, Teshonka brake controller, Provent catch can, GME 3350 UHF, Boo's bash set, Falken Wildpeak AT3W 265/65R18, TPMS, Dobinson/Kings HD 45mm lift, Rhino bars, Drifta 270 awning, spare tyre lift, Ultraguage MX 1.4, TC mod, auxiliary PWR 23 row transmission cooler and radiator cooler bypass, KAON barrier, MM nudgebar, Fyrlyt Luxsis 5000. Stockman allroada pod trailer with ARB Simpson 3 RTT.

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                • #9
                  Did not think I was alone in this… appreciate your thoughts so far!

                  Our Paj is a daily driver on the freeway. Come summer it is a tow tug for the 2T boat, generally 3 hours up to Lake Eildon and then back. It currently has Hancook Krugen H/T tyres as fitted when we purchased it. I had planned to replace these but they were actually better than expected so left them on - even did a few Vic high country huts with them in the dry!

                  We want to adventure a little further so will need an A/T tyre, probably 70-80% on road, fair towing in summer and Melbourne in the winter = Wet roads.

                  I am also attending the Pajero Club 4x4 Proficiency course this weekend so have the choice to change tyres before this, or wait to see what everyone else is running with their opinions/experience.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by NFT5
                    Flip a coin mate. You have a less than 50% chance of making the right decision.

                    I think that almost everyone who works in a retail tyre store is going to be somewhat biased towards the brands that they sell, so waste of time asking them for an honest recommendation.

                    You could ask on an appropriate forum, but all you'll get there is post purchase rationalisation or opinions based on no experience at all. Or buyer's remorse so strong that a poster would do almost anything to prevent someone else buying a product, regardless of whether it suited the other person's needs. If asking for a recommendation for one of two choices, most responses will be for a third option, usually completely unrelated.

                    Of course, one could go along to a 4WD Club outing and actually observe how different tyres perform in given conditions..........Nah, far too sensible.

                    Given that no-one wants to make a mistake with something as intrinsically safety related as tyres, nor something as potentially expensive, the research path can be a long and arduous one. Sometimes little comments like "the newer one seemed to have less positives in the wet" can have serious implications, especially when the comparison is being made against a tyre that used to have a terrible wet weather performance, but not any more. Why?

                    I went through a similar process, seeing the writing on the wall for the need to replace tyres that were simply not doing the job. Simple it is not. First you have to identify why the tyres you have aren't doing what you want and then try to find another that will. Are you really comparing apples with apples? The Toyo is a 12.7mm tread depth and 120R load/speed rating while the Cooper is 9.2mm and 116H. Not 100% clear on the Cooper website but I suspect not even LT construction. A better comparison with the Toyo would probably be the Mickey Thompson Deegan 38 AT.
                    100% agree, so many opinions and not much experience…
                    🤷‍♂️

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      17" or 18" rims?

                      Do you want standard diameter or go up a profile and gain 13ishh mm of ground clearance?

                      Manual or auto trans?

                      If Auto do you have a torque convertor lockup kit fitted?

                      OJ.
                      2011 PB Base White Auto, Smartbar, Cooper STMaxx LT235/85R-16,TPMS, HR TB, 3 x Bushskinz, front +40mm Dobinson , rear +50mm EHDVR Lovells, Dobinson MT struts and shockers, Peddars 5899 cone springs, Windcheater rack, GME UHF, Custom alloy drawer system inc. 30lt Engel & 2 x 30 AH LiFePo batteries + elec controls, Tailgate hi-lift/long struts, Phillips +100 LB & HB, Lightforce 20" single row driving beam LED lightbar, Scanguage II.
                      MM4x4 Auto Mate, Serial No 1 .

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I read reviews and opinions on here regarding brands and size, and cross reference people reviews regarding, kilometres, % rating of would I buy again, noise, and wet grip on tyres reviews.com.au.

                        Their video reviews are about as informative as the tyre shop. Black, round, and I like em...

                        I asked TR to add data and explanations on things like fissure depth, tread depth, silica content, weight and the like. They responded positively but also kind of summed it up as hard to achieve as each tyre is different.
                        We’re your best source for Australian independent, consumer generated tyre reviews, tyre comparisons and tyre advice. Read reviews based on your exact car.
                        Last edited by jaffles; 1 week ago.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I will say i have 697's & i find they have very good manners on dirt & on tar, in the wet & in the dry.

                          These tyres to me have good manners, i have18" rims & lowish profile walls, no i won't be buying them again & they came on the car.

                          But i have no ccomplaints about how they handle or noise etc.

                          I've done 10,000k's on these maybe 70% rubber on them
                          Mitsubishi Pajero NX MY16 GLS with Sand Grabba floor mats, Ultragauge, Automate & Paddle gear shifters with Vlads traction control mod, Nautia switch panel, ARB compressor, Redarc Tow Pro, Anderson plug, Bushskinz front & rear alloy plates, Kaon light duty cargo barrier & rear door table

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Interesting . I’m looking around for a less noisy , more highway focused set of tyres after four years of Bridgestone Duelers that the dealer supplied to sweeten the deal when we bought our 2017 NX at 12 months old . I’m never going to conquer the Tanami or drive to the Cape . I tow my 1500 kg pop top to grassy caravan parks on highways . I spend most of my time driving to the shops ! The local dealer wants me to buy Kumho HT51 at $279 each . A dealer in a bigger twin wants to fit Dunlop Grantreks . It’s confusing . Any personal experience or recommendations from members out there driving the way I do ? Thanks

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Huxter View Post
                              Interesting . I’m looking around for a less noisy , more highway focused set of tyres after four years of Bridgestone Duelers that the dealer supplied to sweeten the deal when we bought our 2017 NX at 12 months old .
                              Just a decent quality road tyre. this ones 10 ply might be bit more than you need though, stay original diameter tyres.

                              https://www.coopertires.com.au/our-r...x4-tyres/at3lt

                              Looking at 697's i'm sure you could find a better road tyre as far as wear goes and i'm damn sure if you let them get lumpy uneven wear they would certainly be noisy.

                              It is interesting how everyone has differing experience & opinion, i find 697's that are couple years old, tyres are in good nick & evenly worn, their manners & noise is quite good, to me & i'm no expert though .

                              I have road tyres on a Triton ute, it is a different vehicle i get that, but Pajero is far better manners on 697's, it isn't a ute either

                              697's i want something with tougher sidewalls



                              Mitsubishi Pajero NX MY16 GLS with Sand Grabba floor mats, Ultragauge, Automate & Paddle gear shifters with Vlads traction control mod, Nautia switch panel, ARB compressor, Redarc Tow Pro, Anderson plug, Bushskinz front & rear alloy plates, Kaon light duty cargo barrier & rear door table

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