PB Challenger as the only vehicle

[etrain]

Hi guys

I've just arrived on the forum. I'm doing the research before committing to a larger vehicle that'll suit our families lifestyle. We currently drive a T31 X-Trail and even though they are ok off road as far as softroaders go, I'd still like something larger with stronger components etc....and no CVT

With a budget of $20K, there are a few good NP Petrol Pajeros going around, but I've also seen some value for money Challengers. My main concern is not having owned a diesel before. The petrol costs in the Paj doesn't put me off as much as the maintenance on a small capacity turbo diesel doing many short trips around town during the week.

What are people's experiences with the PB Challenger as a daily? Do the 2.5TDs give many headaches when used as a daily / weekend beach warrior?


Any feedback appreciated

[littleriver]

Best go anywhere vehicle we have ever owned ...

[old Jack]

All 4wds have higher maintenance cost compared to a conventional car, and modern turbo diesels cost more to maintain than petrol engines, so what ever you buy it will cost more to run than your X-Trail. Short runs are not good for any vehicle especially diesels, they will do it but you need to decrease the maintenance intervals, so this is an added cost.

How many kids and how old? The Challenger is narrower than the Pajero so car seats can be a problem if you need to have 3 across. The centre of the rear seat is only really suitable for small children and for short distances. The Challenger lift up tailgate is much easier to live with than the heavy rear door of the Pajero. The Pajero has more grunt for towing. Pajero auto trans is nicer than the Challenger, but this can be fixed with Auto Mate.
Auto trans are generally easier to use off road than manual trans but this comes at higher maintenance cost.

OJ.

[etrain]

Appreciate the feedback guys.

old Jack , we have two kids, still on the young side so a narrow Challenger wont be much of an issue I'd expect. Main weigh up for me would be the thirstier Paj VS the maintenance on the Challenger's diesel power plant.

I'm thinking petrol Pajero for now. I know it's not just a case of two extra spark plugs and some more oil at service but from what I've read, there's less to go wrong than with the diesel.

[littleriver]

Appreciate the feedback guys.

old Jack , we have two kids, still on the young side so a narrow Challenger wont be much of an issue I'd expect. Main weigh up for me would be the thirstier Paj VS the maintenance on the Challenger's diesel power plant.

I'm thinking petrol Pajero for now. I know it's not just a case of two extra spark plugs and some more oil at service but from what I've read, there's less to go wrong than with the diesel.

petrols are for short term savings... diesels are for long term savings........

[old Jack]

Appreciate the feedback guys.

old Jack , we have two kids, still on the young side so a narrow Challenger wont be much of an issue I'd expect. Main weigh up for me would be the thirstier Paj VS the maintenance on the Challenger's diesel power plant.

I'm thinking petrol Pajero for now. I know it's not just a case of two extra spark plugs and some more oil at service but from what I've read, there's less to go wrong than with the diesel.

The difference in fuel cost if you do 15,000kms a year and fuel is $1.50 a litre, and you get 12 litres per 100kms from the diesel and 18 litres per 100kms from the petrol then the fuel saving per year is $1350 running a diesel. Given the price of injectors, common rails, pumps, oil etc., etc. for a diesel engine compared to a petrol engine, I suspect a older petrol engine is cheaper to run and maintain than a older diesel engine.

OJ.

[littleriver]

The difference in fuel cost if you do 15,000kms a year and fuel is $1.50 a litre, and you get 12 litres per 100kms from the diesel and 18 litres per 100kms from the petrol then the fuel saving per year is $1350 running a diesel. Given the price of injectors, common rails, pumps, oil etc., etc. for a diesel engine compared to a petrol engine, I suspect a older petrol engine is cheaper to run and maintain than a older diesel engine.

OJ.

the OP has $20k to spend ... remembering OP asked a NP Petrol (Old) vs Challenger (newer)...
haven’t seen anyone post pump or injector failure as of yet on the challengers ... <300k km +++
when and if the OP decides to load up or tow the petrol L/100kms will be considerably higher then the diesel ...

we do short trips all week ... try to do highway runs weekends (lucky enough the challengers don’t run a dpf )...

NB There’s starting to be a more of a challenger following ... they are becoming more popular (hence price increases) ...... many a prado/navara/patrol owner has now moved onto a challenger and been quoted as luving them ..... even to go so far as being able to trump those vehicles once the challengers had front & rear diff lockers ...

At the end of the day on the OP can decide on his/her preference.. we are just here to add our 2 cents worth ...

[old Jack]

the OP has $20k to spend ... remembering OP asked a NP Petrol (Old) vs Challenger (newer)...
haven’t seen anyone post pump or injector failure as of yet on the challengers ... <300k km +++
when and if the OP decides to load up or tow the petrol L/100kms will be considerably higher then the diesel ...

we do short trips all week ... try to do highway runs weekends (lucky enough the challengers don’t run a dpf )...

NB There’s starting to be a more of a challenger following ... they are becoming more popular (hence price increases) ...... many a prado/navara/patrol owner has now moved onto a challenger and been quoted as luving them ..... even to go so far as being able to trump those vehicles once the challengers had front & rear diff lockers ...

At the end of the day on the OP can decide on his/her preference.. we are just here to add our 2 cents worth ...

For $20K you will get a lower km and newer Challenger than a Pajero.
Everyone goes on about the saving in fuel cost of a diesel but when you crunch the numbers and then take maintenance cost into it then there is not a lot in it.
Agree the Challenger engine has not had injector, injector or dpf problems which is great, but we cannot ignore the block/head problem that causes overheating, this problem seems to be happening less as more engines are replaced under "extended" warranty. Also the expensive tappet adjustment and timing/balance belts maintenance.
Body and Suspension wise the Challenger is pretty robust so no issues there.
The manual trans in the Challenger had the occasional problem but most of these should have come to the surface and been fixed. The high first gear and diff ratios mean you need to slip the clutch if travelling heavy or towing on steep start off and off road.
The auto trans in the Challenger is underwhelming, lazy, sluggish and rubbery that chews fuel, it goes into limp mode when towing but these problems can be fixed with fitting Auto Mate. Cost of ATF flush and change is significant in both the Challenger and Pajero.

If I had my time again and had the choice between a NW Pajero and a PB/PC Challenger I would still choose the Challenger as it suits my requirements better.
Would I like the Pajero 3,2 CRD and Aisin 5 speed in the Challenger?
Absolutely!
Do I want the extra size and bulk, heavy rear door and the NVH of the unibody/ monocoque construction?
No.


OJ.

[etrain]

Thanks for the great discussion guys. Didn't mean to open a can of worms

littleriver your usage would be very close to how we'll use ours. I won't be towing with it. And your right, I have noticed an increase in PB Challenger prices.

old Jack great info there thanks mate. And it's like you say, things seem to even out with this particular comparison.

One can only do so much faffing about so I'll get the first good one I find checked out and if the report is good, take it...Challenger or Pajero

Thanks again for the info

[Chris4x4]

Hey guys update at 8.5 years/135k km. Wife uses ours as a daily and is very happy, she loves her music loud so I put in a serious stereo. Two or three times a year we go outback NSW for pest reduction duties, camping etc, tow max around 1200kg.
I have no real mods at all no changes to suspension, or anything at all under the bonnet, no catch cans, nothing, still running original bash plates.
Car runs well nothing to report, no leaks, auto just performs like any other auto, we have no complaints at all with it, never had any limp modes nothing. Had the airbag loom done and other recalls all no problem.
Have thought about upgrading to new Prado for nicer ride etc, but while Chally keeps performing like this ill keep my 60K

[BruceandBobbi]

Have thought about upgrading to new Prado for nicer ride etc,

Make sure the Prado comes with these in the glovebox.

[Ozzyal]

Hey guys update at 8.5 years/135k km. Wife uses ours as a daily and is very happy, she loves her music loud so I put in a serious stereo. Two or three times a year we go outback NSW for pest reduction duties, camping etc, tow max around 1200kg.
I have no real mods at all no changes to suspension, or anything at all under the bonnet, no catch cans, nothing, still running original bash plates.
Car runs well nothing to report, no leaks, auto just performs like any other auto, we have no complaints at all with it, never had any limp modes nothing. Had the airbag loom done and other recalls all no problem.
Have thought about upgrading to new Prado for nicer ride etc, but while Chally keeps performing like this ill keep my 60K

my Challenger has about 240k on it now , still drives beautifully .
I'm considering buying a new Triton dual cab , but must say , I'm finding it hard to imagine it will be any nicer to drive then the Challenger .
I'm thinking I'll trade the wife's car and give her this Challenger .

[etrain]

Hi guys, just to update. I ended up getting the Pajero and not the Challenger. It's an NS V6 Very well looked after with all services done at 148K km. Challenger prices have been high and stock very low up here in QLD. Does have a very odd front end noise that only reveals itself on hot days late in the afternoon but ....I'll leave that for another thread.

[gumbs]

In a lot of ways the pajero is the better vehicle but with any second hand car it's always about the specific example. I personally wouldn't buy a challenger at the current prices. I paid $32k for mine as a demo 4.5 years ago, in current market rates it's worth $25-28k. The PBs are the same price they were when I bough my PC. But they've got 60k more on the clock.

I'm sure you will enjoy the Pajero.