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  • lpg conversion decision (NM)

    I have just bought a 2000 (NM) pajero with the 3.5 litre petrol engine. Realistically I will be driving it 90% suburbia with 1 weekend a month offroad (like 2 weekends, but ... never quite works out that way ).

    I am looking at converting to dual fuel (petrol-lpg) . The advice I am getting to date from a number of sources is that:
    - Provided the installation is done properly there shouldn't be any problems.
    - 2000-2002 was no problem to convert. 2003 model with the 3.8 litre had some issues requiring additional expensive equipment (over $2000) to be fitted. Understand that this issue was fixed later in 2004
    - Mitsubishi have some installer they recommend for conversions

    I also talked to one owner with a dual fuel pajero who said after initial adjustment, the setup worked fine.
    From a fuel cost point of view it would appear to be a good option with payback on the installation cost in about 1 year.

    However I do see from the forum that some cars have had backfiring problems.

    I would appreciate if you can you give me some perpective here

    1) Are problems such as backfiring (or other problems) common with the lpg pajeros (3.5 litre engine after 2000), or do these problems occur sometimes or rare isolated problems.

    2) Any tips on how to avoid these issues ?

    Pete
    2009 NT Diesel Pajero.

  • #2
    Hi i know of 3 others on here who have had issues. Including me. Best advice i could give you is go for an injected system now and be done with it. It could cost you more later down the track as i have found out with mine.
    Factor in the following items at a later if you go down the lpg mixer path.
    Airflow Meter just over 700.00
    Top part of airbox 150.00
    lower part of airbox 300-500 it varies.
    airbox clips 9.00 each.
    Any other bits that may break because of a backfire.
    Then again you might get lucky and have no issues at all.

    Mine is currentley held together with gaffer tape and tie down straps around the airbox. Not replacing any parts till im comfortable it wont re occur again touch wood.

    Wishing you all the best with it. Do it once do it right. Wish i did.

    Best Regards

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Pete,

      I drive an 2004 3.8 petrol running on petrol / lpg. The injected conversion was fitted, as due to emission requirements for a 2004 model vehicle (euro 3), that was the only option. I have had it for 12 months and not one issue. It works seamlessly. Starts on petrol and changes over to gas once the engine has some warmth in it - usually after about 1 minute on a Canberra winters morning (shorter time on warmer days). When the gas runs out it automatically changes back to petrol. The conversion was $4500, but after the $2000 Fed Govt. rebate, I have almost recouped the balance after 12 months. I am glad I made the choice.
      Pajero MY05 Exceed, DVD / (infamous) Sat Nav, Petrol / Injected LPG, alloy bull bar, Blue Tongue compressor, Pirahna dual battery system, Cibie Oscar SC driving lights, UHF, Next G car kit, Waeco FF40, set Cooper ST's, cargo barrier and polyairs.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks all for the advice which is really useful. Sounds like the injected system is a better long term bet . I assume this also can be fitted to the 2000 model.

        I searched on injected lpg systems and came across the following at one of the lpg installers sites.

        http://www.doctorgas.net.au/
        Even the best installation of single-point technology cannot guarantee the system will not backfire. The principle of mixing gas and air at the throttle body means the plenum chamber and inlet manifold will also be charged with the explosive mixture en-route to the cylinders, rather than just the air that the engine has been designed for. A vacuum leak on the manifold or a spark plug /HT lead problem is all it takes for the system to backfire ?often resulting in damage to the vehicle's air filter housing or air-flow meter.

        Pete
        2009 NT Diesel Pajero.

        Comment


        • #5
          hi there i have a nm 3.5 oct 2001 build i had mine converted to gas but was the old style ( fork lift conversion) not injected . had so many hassles with idleling, going out of tune and also had a back fire only when cranking it over , that was enough to blow the top off the air cleaner. i did away with that and now have an injected system on , no hassles it starts on petrol til warm then goes to gas , also when it runs out of gas it just switches to gas . every thing is tuned by laptop . the system is a kme from polland . they should ban the older system because the installers will not stand by them . some installers flatley refuse to install the older systems on the pajeros because of backfireing issues , or get you to sign a waver for the backfire issue . the only way to go is injected .

          Comment


          • #6
            Zacc/Linou/Wrexed03,

            How have you found the performance on injected gas? In the old days it used to be said that take-off performance suffered if on gas.
            Retired - 2001 NM Exceed V6, 2" Lovell/Bilstein Lift, Wildcat Headers and Custom 2.5" Lukey Ultra Flo System, Milford barrier, Cooper HTs and GY MT/Rs, TJM sump and transmission bashplates

            Comment


            • #7
              Going through this issue now.. to inject or not to inject, so will be reading replies with intrest

              Ray

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Endorphin View Post
                Zacc/Linou/Wrexed03,

                How have you found the performance on injected gas? In the old days it used to be said that take-off performance suffered if on gas.
                Endorphin,

                There is a slight reduction in performance under acceleration. However, I find the vehicle has slightly more torque lower down, which results in less gear down changes around town. When rolling through a t-intersection on gas in 60km zone, will hold third gear on LPG. On petrol, will usually change down to second gear.

                The engine does not pull as well in the higher rev range, around 4500 rpm onwards, but normal driving does not necessitate reving the engine this high most of the time. Overall, very happy with the performance.
                Pajero MY05 Exceed, DVD / (infamous) Sat Nav, Petrol / Injected LPG, alloy bull bar, Blue Tongue compressor, Pirahna dual battery system, Cibie Oscar SC driving lights, UHF, Next G car kit, Waeco FF40, set Cooper ST's, cargo barrier and polyairs.

                Comment


                • #9
                  linou,

                  is this the injected gas ?? system

                  Ray

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Mine is not the injected system but the difference if any i cant really notice between the two fuels. If anything runs smoother on gas providing i dont have any backfires.
                    I still havent gone down the injected path as yet havent had the time with work and family etc etc.
                    I havent fixed my broken bits either as yet since my last couple of explosions just incase it decides to go bang again. Will be doing that once i replace the current system.
                    Do it once do it right just go injected.
                    As stated above yes there may be a possibility to get a backfire on an injected system if the manifold decides to get flooded with gas but the chances are far less for this to occur than on a ring/mixer setup.

                    Regards

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thanks linou and wrexed03.

                      What kind of range do you get out of a tank of gas? Also what is the typical tank size for gas?

                      Cheers,
                      Mike
                      Retired - 2001 NM Exceed V6, 2" Lovell/Bilstein Lift, Wildcat Headers and Custom 2.5" Lukey Ultra Flo System, Milford barrier, Cooper HTs and GY MT/Rs, TJM sump and transmission bashplates

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hassles with our LPG conversion, too.
                        Additional costs due to backfire:
                        New leads, sparkies, labour: $500
                        New airbox: $500+ (also held together with ocky straps and superglue for now ). Made it a $4100 conversion (not injected), with $2000 govt. subsidy.

                        We did all the pre-fitting maintenance suggested by the fitter.

                        LPG fitter made a backfire valve, but this only takes the edge off. Backfired once since and blew apart the bodgy airbox a little more. This is pre new leads, sparkplugs etc.. Got the TopGun MAX Leads and NGK spark plugs fitted at the closer gap just yesterday.

                        Another local LPG converter told us that he suggests not to bother LPG converting Pajeros, "too many problems".
                        2009 Mitsubishi Pajero NT GL, Diesel, Auto, Rear diff lock, side airbags, 3000kg towpack, Milford cargo barrier, Rhino roof rails+ bars, Teshonka Prodigy brake controller

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Around town (Canberra so not hevy traffic) consistently get 330kms out of 64 usable litres (68 litre tank). On the highway a little more, although I have not done much highway driving since the conversion, so hard to say.

                          Have not had any problems with the injected kit.
                          Pajero MY05 Exceed, DVD / (infamous) Sat Nav, Petrol / Injected LPG, alloy bull bar, Blue Tongue compressor, Pirahna dual battery system, Cibie Oscar SC driving lights, UHF, Next G car kit, Waeco FF40, set Cooper ST's, cargo barrier and polyairs.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I'm gonna sound like a real snob here (sorry - i'm really not but I'm not sure why you would bother with an LPG conversion. If fuel economy is an issue then an alternative given the costs, the trouble, touring range and availability of LPG in more remote areas, might be to think about trading it on a DID - even a second hand one.

                            We recently traded our NM 3.5 on an NP DID and it is a better vehicle in every single respect except engine noise (fairly easy to get used to) and perhaps slightly higher service costs. More grunt, better driveability, best case fuel use of 8.5l/100Km (freeway), worst case so far of 12.5L/100km (off-road), 1000km touring range (1500 with our LRA), better resale prospects - we couldnt be happier. I know it is a bit of leap in purchase price but after I ran the figures it clearly came out as the cheaper long term option, and I suspect is still well in front of an LPG converted petrol. LPG seems like a lot of money and heartache to get just 330km range. And I love not having to visit servos very often.

                            Sorry to all the petrol owners - I was one of you - Honest!
                            Pat
                            16 Mitsu NX Pajero GLX
                            10 Ford LV Focus ST / XR5

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Pat, I'm slowly coming to the same conclusion. Although a oil burner is not on the radar for the moment. I suspect I'll keep the petrol NM for a while longer and go for a DID when the $$$ become available. Glad to hear you're happy with yours.

                              Mike
                              Retired - 2001 NM Exceed V6, 2" Lovell/Bilstein Lift, Wildcat Headers and Custom 2.5" Lukey Ultra Flo System, Milford barrier, Cooper HTs and GY MT/Rs, TJM sump and transmission bashplates

                              Comment

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